A lot of beginner questions!

Questions from those who are just starting or considering getting into the ant keeping hobby. If you’re intimidated or confused by the in-depth posts of the other sections of this forum, feel free to post here, and we'll start from square one!

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danb1985
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Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:58 pm

A lot of beginner questions!

Post: # 47535Post danb1985
Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:58 am

Hi (sorry for all the questions)

I have recently began looking at ants in more detail and over the last week stumbled upon some of the amazing ways you can keep ants and actually build a colony.

If I am going to get into the hobby I’d really like to do this from scratch with just a queen. Is this recommended or should a total beginner get some workers to start off?

My wife has a lot of issues of having ants in the house and issues around escaping. I would need to make sure everything was closed in but would probably want to use the anti slip stuff too. How likely is an escape? And how often do you need to apply the anti slip?

I am browsing a uk website and like the look of Formicarium Bastion £19.99 https://www.britishants.com/collections/ant-farms-housing/products/formicarium-bastion . How many ants could be kept in there before needing to expand and would a colony quickly outgrow it? Also, I’ve read a lot about not providing too much space, would this be too big for a beginner colony? If the colony were to use one of the chambers in there for waste, how would it be cleaned out?

With regards to cleaning and feeding, how is this done without escapees? How often do you need to feed?

With regards to species of ants, Which is the best for beginners? The obvious choice seems to be the Lasius so what is the difference between the niger and the flavus? Are there any species that do not need to hibernate?

Shopping list. To start with I’d want the Bastion as mentioned above , plus probably an extension outworld to add later, plus a starter species, would there be anything else I’d need?

Thanks in advance for any replies

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idahoantgirl
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Location: Idaho, USA

Re: A lot of beginner questions!

Post: # 47537Post idahoantgirl
Wed Aug 15, 2018 10:04 am

Starting from scratch is fine for beginners.

I can't vouch for the Bastion thing as I've never heard of it before, so I can't say if it is good at containment or not. At the beginning, you ants will be in a test tube. As long as you have a decent amount of cotton in there you will be fine. Some ants (solenopsis and Camponotus) are known to try to chew through cotton, but If that's a concern you can place the tube in a tupperware container (smooth, rounded edges) and place a barrier such as insect-a slip of dry baby powder. ( if you use insect-a-slip, remember that thicker is not better. The thicker you apply, the more little foot holds and ridges appear. Mikey Bustos reccomends that you dilute it 3 parts water to one part fluon for optimal efficency if you buy from bio quip. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7JprexIx60M
Here is the thing about escapes.Workers always want to explore, so naturally they are going to try to find a way out. As long as your setup is good,and depending on the species, and as long as your provided them with plenty of food and the proper amount of space, escapes will be attempted less often. Also, most escapes are just a few workers. Workers are the ones that want to explore. Not the queen. They would only move the queen if they found a more suitable living space somewhere else, which is fairly unlikely. So if a few workers escape, big deal. As long as you aren't keeping a stinging species, they can do nothing. Except die. They aren't going to start chewing in your walls unless you have really wet walls and you are caring really poorly for your ants. Not sure about how often to change the barrier as I always use dry baby powder.

The bastion looks like a smaller nest than AC's old version of Hybrid. I was say it could maybe house up to 200-500 workers max (unless it's Camponotus in which case considerably less.) This could take anywhere from a few months to a few years to fill depending on the species. Also once your colony is at a size you like, it is easy to keep them there by reducing protein and temperature. I have managed to keep my fast growing tetramorium colony at the same size for a year in my old, small Hybrid. Once they filled the nest, I just gave them less protein.

It is still recomended to house your queens in a test tube until they have 10-15 workers (usually its 25-50 but this looks like a pretty small nest). Since your colonies are most likely to die in the founding stage, It's best to keep them in a test tube so you don't soil your nest (gypsum is absorbent) It also gives you more access to your colonies at the beginning for troubleshooting.

Yes,colonies generally do use a chamber for waste. In 3d printed and acrylic nests, this hasn't been a problem. Since gypsum is more absorbent, I can't say whether or not mold would be an issue. In my hybrid, my tetramorium set up a chamber close to an exit as a garbage dump. I found that when i connected a water test tube to that opening the empty their garbage into the tube and I could then remove the tube and dump it. If that doesn't work, when they grow big enough to use that chamber they will generally move it to their outworld.

When your queen is by her self ( no workers) in a tube, she will not need to be fed at all (assuming she is fully claustral)

When you do have workers, but haven't reached the 10-20 ish mark, you wedge a one inch section of drinking straw between the exit cotton and the side of the tube to act as a cozy tunnel. Then place the whole set up in a tupperware container with a barrier. Place food outside of the tube pretty close to the tunnel. Don't feed them in the tube as this causes stress and mold outbreaks. Don't worry about over feeding. You can't.Just make sure they always have access to a small amount of liquid sugary substance and a small amount of protein. When they dry out change them for new ones.

When your colony is substantial, (In the hundred's) They are obviously going to need more food. I think I ended up feeding my one mealworm or cricket every day or other day I believe at the peak of their growth spurt. You wil get a feel for how much the need and how long it takes them to finish what you give them. Every species is different :)

Cleaning kinda isn't done in the nest until you move them to something else (assuming you use a nest that is cleanable) In the outworld you just use a pair of tweezers or a little spoon to pick up garbage. As long as you have a good barrier, removing the lid is just fine :)
Proverbs 6:6-8

Go to the ant, you sluggard;
consider its ways and be wise!
It has no commander,
no overseer or ruler,
yet it stores its provisions in summer
and gathers its food at harvest.

Keeping Tetramorium immigrans, Tapinoma Sessile

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idahoantgirl
Posts: 1521
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2015 11:52 am
Location: Idaho, USA

Re: A lot of beginner questions!

Post: # 47538Post idahoantgirl
Wed Aug 15, 2018 10:05 am

Part 2:

As far as species go... It all depends on where you live. If you live in the US, buying queens from across state borders is illegal. In most other countries its alright though. Check your laws. If you plan to catch your queen (which is so much more fun than buying) you don't get to pick which species you get... you just get what you get. Lasius is a pretty good beginner species. I couldn't say about the differences on Flavus and niger.

Hibernation once again depends on where you live.

Other things for Shopping List:
Test tubes
Cotton
2 large Brushes (handy in case there is an escape)
tweezers
barrier (insect-a-slip, baby powder)
Sugars (you won't have to buy anything for this tho)
Mealworms, crickets, cockroaches or fruitflies ( if you want to not have to raise feeder insects, go to the pet store and buy a container of Mealworms or crickets or cockroaches. Freeze them, transfer them to a mason jar, and store them in the freezer. No mess, no smell, no watching anything suffer. Never feed your colony insects caught from outdoors.
When your colony is hungry, take one out and cut it in half ( or just cut off a small section depending on the size of your colony) and drop it into the outworld. Cutting the frozen is nice since it doesn't leave a mess of your ant scissors. It will thaw in the outworld.
you could also raise feeder insects, but there is a lot of work and smell involved. Fruit flies are awesome for young colonies, but their cultures are fairly pricy, and It's not super easy to keep them somewhere where you won't smell them and the temps wont sterilize them.
Hope I helped :)
Proverbs 6:6-8

Go to the ant, you sluggard;
consider its ways and be wise!
It has no commander,
no overseer or ruler,
yet it stores its provisions in summer
and gathers its food at harvest.

Keeping Tetramorium immigrans, Tapinoma Sessile

danb1985
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:58 pm

Re: A lot of beginner questions!

Post: # 47545Post danb1985
Wed Aug 15, 2018 10:20 am

Wow thanks for all the info. I live in the (UK) so will probably go for the niger or flavus. The big thing really now is will the wife let me haha. I’m interested in starting from scratch and seeing a natural colony grow.

What’s the chances of the flavus or niger getting into the 1000’s and if a colony got really big, how ethical would it be to set up and outworld containing something like a Venus fly trap to control numbers?

User avatar
idahoantgirl
Posts: 1521
Joined: Sat Sep 12, 2015 11:52 am
Location: Idaho, USA

Re: A lot of beginner questions!

Post: # 47547Post idahoantgirl
Wed Aug 15, 2018 10:28 am

Well to put it in persepective, my tetramorium fill my 4" by 4" hybrid nest, and I estimate there are about 1,000 workers in there. My colony is 3 years old but I have kept them at the same size for a year. Mikey tried something like that with a fly trap thing. His ants figured out how to just crawl in and out without getting stuck, but that was a different type of trap. It would definitely be an interesting project! "Ethical" is subjective. I personally think it's just fine. It would be easier to control growth by limiting protein, but yeah I think a fly trap could be awesome if it works.
Proverbs 6:6-8

Go to the ant, you sluggard;
consider its ways and be wise!
It has no commander,
no overseer or ruler,
yet it stores its provisions in summer
and gathers its food at harvest.

Keeping Tetramorium immigrans, Tapinoma Sessile

danb1985
Posts: 5
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2018 12:58 pm

Re: A lot of beginner questions!

Post: # 47548Post danb1985
Wed Aug 15, 2018 10:32 am

Thanks for your help. Just need to talk round the Mrs and pick the perfect starter home

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